November 1999 Gasification Archive

For more information to help people develop better stoves for cooking with biomass fuels in developing regions, please see our web site: http://www.bioenergylists.org

From larcon at sni.net Mon Nov 1 13:24:06 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:25 2004
Subject: Forwarding reply from Bhutan on Charcoal making
Message-ID: <v01540b06b443805bf417@[204.131.233.36]>

Stovers:
The following is a follow-up to an October 19 request from Bhutan
for assistance. Chhimi provides answers to questions that I raised at that
time. I hope that other will be able to help - perhaps especially along
the lines of work done by Elsen Karstad. I add a few more comments to
Chhimi below.

Chhimi:
Our list is mostly dealing with small single-family cookstoves.
But there are persons on the list whose technologies for making charcoal
may be of help. It is not easy to economically convert sawdust to charcoal
- but your new ansers may give someone the information needed to halp.

Be sure to look at the Alex English web site also, if you have not.
Good luck. Ron

Ron

>From: "Chhimi Thendup" <bbpl-tl@druknet.net.bt>
>To: "RONAL W LARSON" <larcon@sni.net>
>Subject: Charcoal making stoves.
>Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 14:24:34 +0600
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>X-Priority: 3
>X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
>
>This is to acknowledge your E-mail dt. 20.10.99, on the subject. I have
>gone through your informative E-mail and are giving herewith the reply to
>various queries.
>

>a) The site http/solstice.crest.org/renewables/stores-list-archives /
> stove wave page - is not opening, the server is not responding.

(Ron): There are a few errors in that address. Try:

http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/

This is especially where you will learn about some past work by
Elsen Karstad to convert large amounts of sawdust into charcoal.

>
>b) The local cooking needs are generally curry type & rice
> preparation etc. & the length of time will be 1/2 - 2 1/2 hours or
> slightly more depending on the particular mix-receipe.
>
>c) Our intention is to preserve the forests of the country by utilizing the
> present wastage generated in the factory in processing of particle
> board from fire wood after chipping operation.
>
>d) Our generation of wastes are shown herewith, which are :
>
>Dust generated (wet).
>
>Dust with moisture content:- 30% - 35%.
>Generated quantity = 2400 M.T/year or 200 M.T/month.
>Approx: size of dust composition.
>
>1.0mm - 8.6%
>0.5mm - 50.33%
>0.25mm - 39.67%
>other - 1.40%
>
>Over size chips:
>
>100mm lg. X 25mm wide X 25mm thk.
>
>Over size of chip generated = 4300 M.T/year or 360 M.T/month.
>
>The dust & oversize chips remain unutilized, our intension is to convert
>it to either:
>
> 1. Briquettes from dust particle
>or 2. to charcoal for use in the calcium carbide plant in the vicinity,
> whuch needs it in their process or for domestic useage.
>
>But use of charcoal stove in the country is picking up. From the wood
>dust generated if plain briquettes or charcoal briquettes are made there
>will be better scope of utilization in the country.
>
>Regards,
>
>
>
>Chhimi thendup
>WORKS DIRECTOR

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
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Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From alkaest at wanadoo.fr Tue Nov 2 02:53:09 1999
From: alkaest at wanadoo.fr (ALKAEST Conseil)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:25 2004
Subject: Gaseous emissions from pellets stoves and boilers
In-Reply-To: <v01540b00b43e27ae098c@[204.131.233.15]>
Message-ID: <381E9A8F.5D19CB81@wanadoo.fr>

ALKAEST Conseil is a French consulting organization strongly involved in the
fields of Energy and Environment.

We are currently working on a study concerning the market for pellets stoves and
boilers in France.

In order to make comparisons with gaseous emissions from conventional fuels we are
looking for information about emissions coming from pellets in stoves and domestic
boilers.

Unfortunately we did not find any precise information in the literature available
from manufacturers.

We'd much appreciate to receive any information about this topic.

Many tanks in advance.

Joël Tetard
Directeur des Etudes/Gérant
ALKAEST Conseil
<http://www.alkaest.com>
20 rue de la Libération
F92500 Rueil-Malmaison
France

Tel : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 70
Fax : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 71
Email : marketing@alkaest.com

From tmiles at teleport.com Tue Nov 2 12:15:59 1999
From: tmiles at teleport.com (Tom Miles)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:25 2004
Subject: Gaseous emissions from pellets stoves and boilers
In-Reply-To: <v01540b00b43e27ae098c@[204.131.233.15]>
Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102083108.032d65e0@mail.teleport.com>

Joel,

Stoves -

Contact Averill Cook, Executive Director, Pellet Fuels Institute, 1601 N.
Kent St, Suite 1001, Arlington, VA 22209 (703) 522-6778 Fax (503) 522-0548
email averill@vgernet.net or PFI at wheeler@pelletheat.org

There doesn't appear to be any emissions data on their website at
www.pelletheat.org

Averill recently atttended a conference in the UK sponsored by British
Biogen. He reported that there were 100 attendees including representatives
from Sweden, Norway, Holland, Austria, Germany and Italy.

At least one manufacturer, Whitfield has developed a (Bio Logic) pellet
burner for the European domestic boiler market in the 6Kw-20Kw
(20,000-70,000 BTU/hr) capacity. They have some emissions data on their
website at www.whitfield.com

We began a stove emissions and certification process including standard
methods of stove testing in Oregon in 1979. Later EPA standards were
adopted. Emission factors for Residential Wood Stoves are covered in
Section 1.10.1 of EPA publication AP-42 www.epa/gov

Industry -

While there are benefits to using pellets in industry, and both paper and
wood pellets are used, the emissions standards are simply those that apply
to biomass fuels at a specific facility in any specific location. We used
to see papers on solid fuel emissions (including pellets) presented at the
Association of Air and Waste Management www.awma.org/ (or Pacific Northwest
Section of AWMA www.pnwis.org ) during the 1970s and 80s.

Regards,

Tom

At 09:02 AM 11/2/99 +0100, ALKAEST Conseil wrote:
>ALKAEST Conseil is a French consulting organization strongly involved in the
>fields of Energy and Environment.
>
>We are currently working on a study concerning the market for pellets
>stoves and
>boilers in France.
>
>In order to make comparisons with gaseous emissions from conventional
>fuels we are
>looking for information about emissions coming from pellets in stoves and
>domestic
>boilers.
>
>Unfortunately we did not find any precise information in the literature
>available
>from manufacturers.
>
>We'd much appreciate to receive any information about this topic.
>
>Many tanks in advance.
>
>Joël Tetard
>Directeur des Etudes/Gérant
>ALKAEST Conseil
><http://www.alkaest.com>
>20 rue de la Libération
>F92500 Rueil-Malmaison
>France
>
>Tel : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 70
>Fax : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 71
>Email : marketing@alkaest.com
>
>
>The Bioenergy List is sponsored by:
>David M. Gubanc.P.E. http://www.gubanc.com and
>dk-TEKNIK ENERGY & ENVIRONMENT http://www.dk-teknik.dk
>Other SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
>http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/bioenergy-list-archive/
>Biomass for Energy and Industry, 5-9 June 2000, Sevilla, Spain
>http://www.wip.tnet.de/bi00fc.htm

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thomas R. Miles tmiles@teleport.com
Technical Consultants, Inc. Tel (503) 292-0107/646-1198
1470 SW Woodward Way Fax (503) 605-0208
Portland, Oregon, USA 97225

Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From crouchpa at ix.netcom.com Tue Nov 2 14:05:01 1999
From: crouchpa at ix.netcom.com (John Crouch)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:25 2004
Subject: Gaseous emissions from pellets stoves and boilers
In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.19991102083108.032d65e0@mail.teleport.com>
Message-ID: <NABBIALBHLOANANOIKBHAEOLCJAA.crouchpa@ix.netcom.com>

Monsieur Tetard

I would like to add the following information to Mr. Tom Miles
response.
The Pellet Fuel Institute (PFI) works with a sister organization, the
Hearth Products Association (HPA). PFI focuses on pellet fuel, and
HPA focuses on all wood, coal, and gas burning Hearth products in
North American, including pellet heaters.

We've recently completed some emissions work with a laboratory in
Oregon, and are preparing a paper comparing that work with some work
the USEPA funded on an older pellet heater last winter.

As you may be aware, the US regulatory environment has made
Particulates the priority for Bio-mass devices. We measure
particulates in grams of particulate / Kilogram of fuel. The test
methodology uses a dual filter train, typically from a dilution tunnel
(to facilitate the condensation of the gas phase).

Pellet heaters have been tested in homes (in-situ) in Klamath Falls,
and Medford Oregon, although non of the models used in those tests are
still available (this was almost 10 years ago). Emissions ranged from
less than 2.1 g/kilo to 4.4 g/kilo. More recent test show an average
for five test runs of .98 g/k for particulates, and 2.3 g/k for Carbon
Monoxide.

If you wish to speak to members of the North American Pellet Heater
industry they will all be gathered in on place for an exposition in
March in Baltimore (just prior to Bois Energie 2000 in
Lons-le-Saunier).

Please contact me directly if you wish more information.
Sincerely.

John Crouch
Director of Government Relations
Hearth Products Association
7840 Madison Ave, suite 185
Fair Oaks, California 95628
916.536.2390 voice
888.206.7556 Pager (U.S. only)
916.536.2392 telefax
crouch@hearthassocation.org
www.hearthassociation.org

Joel,

Stoves -

Contact Averill Cook, Executive Director, Pellet Fuels Institute, 1601
N.
Kent St, Suite 1001, Arlington, VA 22209 (703) 522-6778 Fax (503)
522-0548
email averill@vgernet.net or PFI at wheeler@pelletheat.org

There doesn't appear to be any emissions data on their website at
www.pelletheat.org

Averill recently atttended a conference in the UK sponsored by British
Biogen. He reported that there were 100 attendees including
representatives
from Sweden, Norway, Holland, Austria, Germany and Italy.

At least one manufacturer, Whitfield has developed a (Bio Logic)
pellet
burner for the European domestic boiler market in the 6Kw-20Kw
(20,000-70,000 BTU/hr) capacity. They have some emissions data on
their
website at www.whitfield.com

We began a stove emissions and certification process including
standard
methods of stove testing in Oregon in 1979. Later EPA standards were
adopted. Emission factors for Residential Wood Stoves are covered in
Section 1.10.1 of EPA publication AP-42 www.epa/gov

Industry -

While there are benefits to using pellets in industry, and both paper
and
wood pellets are used, the emissions standards are simply those that
apply
to biomass fuels at a specific facility in any specific location. We
used
to see papers on solid fuel emissions (including pellets) presented at
the
Association of Air and Waste Management www.awma.org/ (or Pacific
Northwest
Section of AWMA www.pnwis.org ) during the 1970s and 80s.

Regards,

Tom

At 09:02 AM 11/2/99 +0100, ALKAEST Conseil wrote:
>ALKAEST Conseil is a French consulting organization strongly
involved in the
>fields of Energy and Environment.
>
>We are currently working on a study concerning the market for pellets
>stoves and
>boilers in France.
>
>In order to make comparisons with gaseous emissions from conventional
>fuels we are
>looking for information about emissions coming from pellets in stoves
and
>domestic
>boilers.
>
>Unfortunately we did not find any precise information in the
literature
>available
>from manufacturers.
>
>We'd much appreciate to receive any information about this topic.
>
>Many tanks in advance.
>
>Joël Tetard
>Directeur des Etudes/Gérant
>ALKAEST Conseil
><http://www.alkaest.com>
>20 rue de la Libération
>F92500 Rueil-Malmaison
>France
>
>Tel : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 70
>Fax : +33 (0)1 41 96 90 71
>Email : marketing@alkaest.com
>
>
>The Bioenergy List is sponsored by:
>David M. Gubanc.P.E. http://www.gubanc.com and
>dk-TEKNIK ENERGY & ENVIRONMENT http://www.dk-teknik.dk
>Other SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
>http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/bioenergy-list-archive/
>Biomass for Energy and Industry, 5-9 June 2000, Sevilla, Spain
>http://www.wip.tnet.de/bi00fc.htm

From heat-win at cwcom.net Wed Nov 3 02:37:05 1999
From: heat-win at cwcom.net (T J Stubbing)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding reply from Bhutan on Charcoal making
In-Reply-To: <v01540b06b443805bf417@[204.131.233.36]>
Message-ID: <381FE85B.D30EB766@cwcom.net>

Dear Ron, Chhimi and Stoves,

Within his message "Ronal W. Larson" wrote:

> Our list is mostly dealing with small single-family cookstoves.
> But there are persons on the list whose technologies for making charcoal
> may be of help. It is not easy to economically convert sawdust to charcoal
> - but your new ansers may give someone the information needed to halp.

while included in Chhimi's message was the information that he has 2400 M.T/year
or 200 M.T/month of sawdaust and 4300 M.T/year or 360 M.T/month of oversize wood
chips to convert to either:

> > 1. Briquettes from dust particle
> >or 2. to charcoal for use in the calcium carbide plant in the vicinity,
> > whuch needs it in their process or for domestic useage.

We are already converting 20 to 50 mm diameter split logs to charcoal in only
four hours in an efficient process able to burn the pyrolysis gases produced to
heat the process.

If the 200 TPM of dust and 360 TPM of chips were mixed to produce a more porous
bed of material, batch or continuous drying followed by heating to pyrolysis
temperature using our indirectly heated superheated steam recirculation to do so
I think we could easily process Chhimi's material.

The process could be either drying followed by briquetting followed by conversion
to charcoal or drying followed by cnversion to charcoal followed by briquetting,
whichever was easier.

If Chhimi would like more information I will be pleased to supply it.

Regards,

Thomas (J Stubbing)
<http://www.dryers-airless.mcmail.com>

From pdg at del2.vsnl.net.in Thu Nov 4 02:00:02 1999
From: pdg at del2.vsnl.net.in (P D Grover)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Making Charcoal from Sawdust
Message-ID: <000801bf2693$fd9f8080$b66236ca@cms.pdgdel2.vsnl.net.in>

4th Nov. 1999

Dear Chhimi,

This refer to your query to stovers regarding making of
charcoal from sawdust.

There are two technologies available for this production.
(a) Briquetting sawdust in 55 mm size by screw press and then
carbonize the briquettes in beehive kilns. Many plants are working on this
technology in Malaysia and Indonesia etc. This is technological advanced process
and consumes sufficient power. This charcoal has demand in S.Korea and Japan

(b) The second technology is to carbonize sawdust in shallow
channels by reverse flow of air to obtain powder char. The char is then mixed
with binders such as cooked inedible starch and then briquette the char is two
roll briquette machines. These briquettes are suitable for making carbides or as
fuel. This is labour intensive and needs constant operator attention and there
is atmospheric pollution similar to one generated by making charcoal from wood.
However, if electric blower are used, the smoke emitted during carbonization can
be burnt in a specially designed furnace to take care of pollution. This is low
capital cost operation and machines for briquetting of char are available in
Calcutta. Either of these technologies can be arranged through equipment
supplier and training provided for operation in Bhutan.

Further sawdust can also be used as such in low pressure
boilers for generation of steam/hot water. I do hope this information will
enable you to decide which route you intend to deploy to save on wood fuel.

P.D. Grover

Address
IRP Energy Consultants
44, Community Centre
East of Kailash
New Delhi - 110 065
Tele: 623 5026, 8840
Fax: 91-11-621 8273

From larcon at sni.net Thu Nov 4 16:53:26 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding a request from Sri Lanka
Message-ID: <v01540b01b447accebb0b@[204.131.233.29]>

Stovers: Hopefully someone will know something about a specific publication
requested below.
Also it would probably be of assistance to identify other
publications (through this list and directly) that might be of help in Sri
Lanka.

Winston: I have signed you up (no cost) for "stoves", in the belief that
your organization is the type that we need more of on "stoves". Let me know
anytime you find that we are not supplying information of the type you
need.

I believe that many on our list would like to hear more about the
Saviya Development Foundation - and especially about whether you are doing
work with smaller single-family cook stoves.

Look up our organization's archives and a separate web stoves site
maintained by Alex English:

> > Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
> > http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
> > Stoves Webpage
> > http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html

Hope this is the sort of help you were looking for.

Ron Larson, "stoves" coordinator

>Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:14:59 +0600
>To: stoves@crest.org
>From: Saviya Development Foundation <sdf@sri.lanka.net>
>Subject: Residential wood combustion technology review
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>
>Dear Sir,
>
>
><underline>Residential wood combustion technology review
>
>
></underline>Our organization wish to have a copy of the above publication
>as it seems very important to us regarding the welfare of the
>community.
>
>
>Our organization is a statutory body and a non government organization in
>Sri Lanka. engaged in social service, especially for the low income
>community and also in rehabilitation and campaigns against anti socaial
>activities.
>
>
>Please be good enough to sent your publication mentioned above.
>
>
>Thanks.
>
>
>Yours sincerely,
>
>
>Winston De Silva
>
>President - SDF
>
>
>Address - Saviya Development Foundation
>
> 24/A,Wewelwala Road, Galle,
>
> Sri Lanka.
>
>
>Tel/Fax- 94-9-34281
>
>
>e-mail: sdf@sri.lanka.net

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From NFPWest at aol.com Fri Nov 5 19:17:33 1999
From: NFPWest at aol.com (NFPWest@aol.com)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: D. Justa, plancha stove
Message-ID: <0.5c9808e7.2554ce93@aol.com>

Dear Ron, Rogerio and others,

I wanted to add to what Rogerio has reported about the Justa stoves that
Trees, Water and People (TWP) is promoting in collaboration with PROLENA,
Aprovecho and AHDESA (Honduran Association for Development) in Honduras.
After Hurricane Mitch, Dr. Larry Winiarski of Aprovecho volunteered to go
down to Honduras and help out with a stove project that TWP, AHDESA and
PROLENA were implementing in Suyapa, Honduras with funding from the Oak Ridge
Rotary Club and Rotary International. We originally had funding to build 500
of the plancha (metal plate) stoves that PROLENA had developed.

Larry combined the plancha stove with his Rocket stove technology design to
come up with the Justa stove. The Justa is more efficient as the fuel chamber
is an elbow-shaped piece that directs the flames better to the cooking
surface and is insulated from the body of the stove. The first elbows were
made with metal, but did not last. So, we now have ceramic elbows that
withstand the heat better. We are using wood ash as an insulating material
between the combustion chamber and the body of the stove.

During my trip to Honduras in August, I visited about 10 families in Suyapa
with stoves. I heard from the women that they were saving between 30 - 50% on
fuelwood costs. I agree with Rogerio that these fuelwood savings need to be
studied more systematically, but the anecdotal evidence from the women is
impressive.

I also noticed the women cooking with two little pieces of firewood (1" d. by
6" length). So, I built a Justa stove at my house in Fort Collins, Colorado
and am once again impressed with how little firewood it takes to cook on the
stove.

Anyway, I believe we are onto a stove technology that is not only more
effficient, but also transferable to other regions and countries. Trees,
Water and People, Aprovecho and PROLENA will be introducing the Justa stove
(or some adaptation) into Nicaragua early this year. We will keep you posted
on when and where those workshops will be. TWP will also spread the
technology to our project partners in El Salvador and Guatemala in the coming
year.

Stuart Conway
Trees, Water and People
633 S. College Ave.
Fort Collins, CO 80524
TEL: 970-484-3678
FAX: 970-224-1726
Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From elk at net2000ke.com Sat Nov 6 01:52:12 1999
From: elk at net2000ke.com (Elsen Karstad)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: D. Justa, plancha stove
Message-ID: <199911060704.KAA29445@net2000ke.com>

From larcon at sni.net Fri Nov 12 09:17:31 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding request from Uganda
Message-ID: <v01540b05b451ceaf9d72@[204.131.233.27]>

Stovers: Perhaps there is someone able to assist Adam, with further details?

Adam: 1. I have placed your name on our (free) stoves list - as I am
quite sure that membership with "stoves" will help you in your thesis work.

2. Make sure you spend some time browsing in:

Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/

Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html

There have been numerous discussions over the past several years of
how to do these measurements.

3. On your specific questions about efficiency measurements at high and
low power levels, I can think of no reason that the measurement technique
should be different - although the actual efficiencies could vary a good
deal with power level (and are usually not often enough reported that way).

4. I hope you will also think about the emissions aspects of stoves in
your thesis work - there has been a lot on that topic as well on this list.

5. Look at the stoves doctoral thesis work by Sam Baldwin (degree from
Princeton). There are several others as well that you will find mentioned
in our archives.

6. Elsen Karstad in Nairobi has recently been reporting to us on his
measurements of jiko charcoal stove efficiencies. Perhaps you two could
collaborate - being not too far apart.

7. Good luck. As you learn more, our list would like to be kept informed
of your progress - and of how we might help.

Ron

>
>Dear Sir,
>=20
>I am undertaking a Ph.D research in energy studies. As part of the =
>programme, I am supposed to test the efficiencies of stoves. I have =
>started with domestic stoves. Most of the stoves used in Uganda uses =
>charcoal. Some of improved stoves or ceramic stoves perform poorly in =
>the high power phase when compared with metallic stoves.
>
>I would like to get some guidance on how conduct efficiency testing of =
>charcoal stoves both in the low and high power phase.
>
>With kind regards,
>
>A.M.Sebbit
>
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
>-----
>Adam. M. Sebbit.
>Makerere University
>Department of Mechanical Engineering.
>P.O.Box 7062, Kampala, Uganda
>Tel: 256-41-531173/545029
> Fax : 256-41-530686/530481=20

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From rmiranda at sdnnic.org.ni Fri Nov 12 18:26:34 1999
From: rmiranda at sdnnic.org.ni (Rogerio Miranda)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: looking for Prasad
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991112171733.00959100@ns.sdnnic.org.ni.>

Prasad, please contact me directly regarding ESD. I missed you Email.
rogerio
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Rogerio Carneiro de Miranda
Asesor Tecnico Principal
PROLEÑA/Nicaragua
Apartado Postal C-321
Managua, Nicaragua
TELEFAX (505) 276 2015, 270 5448
EMAIL: rmiranda@sdnnic.org.ni
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From elizabethb at itdg.org.uk Mon Nov 15 10:51:09 1999
From: elizabethb at itdg.org.uk (Liz Bates)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Boiling Point 43 & 44
Message-ID: <E12F8097E5C0D2118DA50080C8E8A81902173F@ITDG-MAIL>

Dear Stoves-group members

This is my twice-yearly contribution to the stoves network, inviting anyone who is interested in household energy to become a reader or contributor to the journal 'Boiling Point'.

The next issue of Boiling Point, whose theme is 'Fuel options for household energy' will soon be available. If anyone would like to receive a copy, or be added to our mailing list, please reply to me giving full postal address and I will add your name to our database.)

The subsequent issue deals with the theme 'Linking household energy with other development objectives'. This topic stems from the need to look at projects as being a way of improving the quality of life for communities, rather than as technical interventions. The journal will examine ways in which household energy considerations can be part of other development sectors, such as forestry, building, health etc. and the social, economic and technical benefits of such an approach.

If you would like to contribute an article for the next edition of Boiling Point, I would be very pleased to hear from you. If you would like further details, please do not hesitate to contact me and I will try to answer your questions. Thank you

(Boiling Point is a journal dedicated to household energy, published by Intermediate Technology Development Group. It is a technical journal for those working in household energy and stoves. It deals with technical, social, financial and environmental issues and aims to improve the quality of life for poor communities living in the developing world.

Best wishes

Liz Bates
lizb@itdg.org.uk
Intermediate Technology Development Group
Schumacher Centre for Technology Development
Bourton Hall
Bourton On Dunsmore
Warwickshire
CV23 9QZ
Tel: +44 - 01788 661100
Fax: +44 - 01788 661101
http://www.oneworld.org/itdg
http:/www.itdg.org.pe

Company Reg. No 871954, England
Charity No 247257

From larcon at sni.net Mon Nov 15 11:07:09 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwading message from Dr. Yuri
Message-ID: <v01540b01b455d686b1eb@[204.131.233.20]>

Stovers:
Dr. Yuri's reply message below was bounced to me because of its
length. Perhaps Alex could determine if it is possible to post it at his
web site. I have deleted the attachment, deleted some extraneous material
and added the three headings below.

As a general warning to all - the crest system will not handle
attachments - just e-mail. Include it in the body if not too long.

Ron

Part A. Header

>From: "Woodcoal" <woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru>
>To: "Francisco Mario Tirado" <mtirado@imagine.com.ar>
>Cc: "stovers" <stoves@crest.org>
>Subject: Re: Svaliava Forest Chemical Factory
>Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 15:27:40 +0300

Part B - the original private message to Dr. Yuri from Senor Tirado:

>
>The source message Francisco Mario Tirado <mtirado@imagine.com.ar>
> to: woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru <woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru> =
>12.11.1999 7:58
> about: Svaliava Forest Chemical Factory
>
> Dear Dr.Yudkevitch:
> Recently I was read your notices about the Svaliava Forest Chemical =
>Factory.
> At NW Argentine (Jujuy Province) there is an eucalyptus forest with =
>300 brick kilns, but we have not any market for the charcoal yet (the =
>steel factory near our charcoal enterprise is closed). =
> I have interest in to contact some traders, investors and new =
>technology developers for put in production our enterprise. The =
>production capacity of our forest is now 2200 t/month (charcoal), and =
>before 7 year forest plan is 4000 t/month.
> Thanks, Francisco Mario Tirado
> Alvear 687 piso 2 C 4600 S.S.Jujuy-Argentine tel/fax =
>++54-388-4261679 mtirado@imagine.com.ar
> =20

Part C. Dr. Yuri's response.

> Dear Dr.Tirado,=20
> We have desighed and ventured the small plant for charcoal =
>production ith capicity about 1000 tonns per year. Some details you can =
>understand from the publication which I attached below. This manuscript =
>wlii be published in Forest Energy Forum N 5.
> Sincerely yours,
> Yury Yudkevitch
> =20
> Stovers,
> Probably, anybody can answer to Dr.Tirado additionally.
> Yudkevitch

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From larcon at sni.net Mon Nov 15 19:10:04 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding: activation of charcoal
Message-ID: <v01540b01b455e431aaa1@[204.131.233.65]>

Stovers: This is a detailed request relative to our older files that I do
not feel equipped to handle. Anyone able to help? (Maybe especially Danny
Day or Susanne Machler?)

Vishal - Please let me know if you would like to be a (free) member of our
stoves list. Please also keep us informed about what you learn. In what
country are you located?

Ron

>From: "Vishal" <sterling@kmr.net>
>To: <owner-stoves@crest.org>
>Subject: activation of charcoal
>Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 19:57:03 +0530

>
>Dear Sir,
>
>This has reference to the response of Mr.Danny Day to the question of
>Ms.Susanne Machler,for method of activating charcoal on 3.10.98.Mr.Danny
>had given a sketch of his equipment for small scale activation of Coconut
>shell charcoal.
>We have gone through your lists of that and the previous months but were
>unable to get the sketch.
>This is to request you to kindly send us that sketch - if possible,as we
>want to try out the activation of coconut shell charcoal for purifying
>water for use in the villages.Our email:sterling@kmr.net
>Thanks,
>Vishal Baid.

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From larcon at sni.net Mon Nov 15 19:10:14 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: "Francisco Mario Tirado" <mtirado@imagine.com.ar>
Message-ID: <v01540b03b455e8d2c134@[204.131.233.65]>

Francisco: Sorry - I just sent this off to the full list and meant to add
you as a cc.
You do not seem to be a member of our list. Please let me know if I
can add you (free). Ron

As a general warning to all - the crest system will not handle
attachments - just e-mail. Include it in the body if not too long.

Ron

Part A. Header

Part B - the original private message to Dr. Yuri from Senor Tirado:

Part C. Dr. Yuri's response.

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From larcon at sni.net Wed Nov 17 01:31:57 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: forwarding charcoaling request from Panama
Message-ID: <v01540b00b457fd9b5fa2@[204.131.233.42]>

Beatriz: I don't think we are exactly the right list, but I don't know of
any other list to suggest. Perhaps someone on the list will respond on the
commercial side of charcoal-making.
I hope that you can find a way to make use of the waste heat from
charcoal-making and especially be sure to not vent the pyrolysis gases.
Make sure they are at least flared.
Let me know if you would like to be a part of our list.
Best of luck.

Stovers: Anyone else want to offer help? Ron

>From: beatriz@latin1.net
>X-Sender: harrick@latin1.net
>Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:05:08 -0500
>To: larcon@sni.net
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>
>Dear Mr. Ronald:
>I am writing to see if you can orient us. We in Panama Republic Central
>America have some 30,000 hectares or more of teak plantations. In a study
>done in a canadian university the waste of teak is very good for charcoal
>and activated charcoal. Our country has no experience or data to do a
>research on the industry and on the supply and demand.
>
>My inquire is if you could help me in contacting us to manufactures of
>charcoal furnaces and if you could help us locate buyers for these charcoal?
>
>Thank you for your time
>Beatriz Harrick
>

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From Auke.Koopmans at fao.org Wed Nov 17 05:15:25 1999
From: Auke.Koopmans at fao.org (Koopmans, Auke (FAORAP))
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: forwarding charcoaling request from Panama
Message-ID: <01JIFX9F3C7Y8Y56BW@faov02.fao.org>

Dear Beatriz,

Our experience with teakwood in Indonesia is that it is a very bad fuel for
use as fuelwood. Apparently during combustion the outside layer becomes
charred (charcoal) and acts as a kind of insulation preventing that heat
penetrates the interior of the wood and the fire dies down. Only where
people are willing to continuously tend the fire can teakwood be used as
fuelwood. However. almost all people I talked to while working in Indonesia
in the saw milling industry preferred other types of wood for fuel if
available. I have no experience with charcoal from teakwood so this
experience may not be valid for charcoal. However, conditions in the
laboratory and making charcoal in large kilns are often different and before
going any further I would recommend to make a large test and see how
teakwood charcoal is received by potential buyers.

With best regards,

Auke Koopmans
Wood Energy Conservation Specialist
FAO-Regional Wood Energy Development Programme
Maliwan Mansion, 39 Phra Atit Road
Bangkok 10200, Thailand
Tel. +66-2-280 2760
Fax +66-2-280 0760
Website: http://www.rwedp.org
Email auke.koopmans@fao.org

> -----Original Message-----
> From: larcon@sni.net [SMTP:larcon@sni.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 1:43 PM
> To: stoves@crest.org
> Cc: beatriz@latin1.net
> Subject: forwarding charcoaling request from Panama
>
> Beatriz: I don't think we are exactly the right list, but I don't know of
> any other list to suggest. Perhaps someone on the list will respond on
> the
> commercial side of charcoal-making.
> I hope that you can find a way to make use of the waste heat from
> charcoal-making and especially be sure to not vent the pyrolysis gases.
> Make sure they are at least flared.
> Let me know if you would like to be a part of our list.
> Best of luck.
>
> Stovers: Anyone else want to offer help? Ron
>
>
> >From: beatriz@latin1.net
> >X-Sender: harrick@latin1.net
> >Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:05:08 -0500
> >To: larcon@sni.net
> >Mime-Version: 1.0
> >
> >Dear Mr. Ronald:
> >I am writing to see if you can orient us. We in Panama Republic Central
> >America have some 30,000 hectares or more of teak plantations. In a study
> >done in a canadian university the waste of teak is very good for charcoal
> >and activated charcoal. Our country has no experience or data to do a
> >research on the industry and on the supply and demand.
> >
> >My inquire is if you could help me in contacting us to manufactures of
> >charcoal furnaces and if you could help us locate buyers for these
> charcoal?
> >
> >Thank you for your time
> >Beatriz Harrick
> >
>
> Ronal W. Larson, PhD
> 21547 Mountsfield Dr.
> Golden, CO 80401, USA
> 303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
> larcon@sni.net
>
>
> Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
> http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
> Stoves Webpage
> http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
> For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
> http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm
Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From rmiranda at sdnnic.org.ni Wed Nov 17 23:54:46 1999
From: rmiranda at sdnnic.org.ni (Rogerio Miranda)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: charcoaling request from Panama and Argentina
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19991117223553.0098aea0@205.218.248.130>

Dear Beatrriz and Francisco Tirado:

The Unversity of Viçosa in Brazil has just developed a very simple
equipment to manufacture charcoal in 8 hours, reducing time consumption,
emissions and increasing efficiency. the equipment is very simple to
operate and low cost. Please contact Dr. Alexandre Pimenta at
(apimenta@mail.ufv.br) whch is responsable for this technology. He is
currently working with PROLEÑA here in Nicaragua and in Honduras
introducing this tech.

regrads

rogerio miranda

.................................................................
>.>>From: beatriz@latin1.net
>>X-Sender: harrick@latin1.net
>>Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:05:08 -0500
>>To: larcon@sni.net
>>Mime-Version: 1.0
>>
>>Dear Mr. Ronald:
>>I am writing to see if you can orient us. We in Panama Republic Central
>>America have some 30,000 hectares or more of teak plantations. In a study
>>done in a canadian university the waste of teak is very good for charcoal
>>and activated charcoal. Our country has no experience or data to do a
>>research on the industry and on the supply and demand.
>>
>>My inquire is if you could help me in contacting us to manufactures of
>>charcoal furnaces and if you could help us locate buyers for these charcoal?
>>
>>Thank you for your time
>>Beatriz Harrick
>>..........................................................................
......
The source message Francisco Mario Tirado <mtirado@imagine.com.ar>
> to: woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru <woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru> =
>12.11.1999 7:58
> about: Svaliava Forest Chemical Factory
>
> Dear Dr.Yudkevitch:
> Recently I was read your notices about the Svaliava Forest Chemical =
>Factory.
> At NW Argentine (Jujuy Province) there is an eucalyptus forest with =
>300 brick kilns, but we have not any market for the charcoal yet (the =
>steel factory near our charcoal enterprise is closed). =
> I have interest in to contact some traders, investors and new =
>technology developers for put in production our enterprise. The =
>production capacity of our forest is now 2200 t/month (charcoal), and =
>before 7 year forest plan is 4000 t/month.
> Thanks, Francisco Mario Tirado
> Alvear 687 piso 2 C 4600 S.S.Jujuy-Argentine tel/fax =
>++54-388-4261679 mtirado@imagine.com.ar
> =20

Part C. Dr. Yuri's response.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Rogerio Carneiro de Miranda
Asesor Tecnico Principal
PROLEÑA/Nicaragua
Apartado Postal C-321
Managua, Nicaragua
TELEFAX (505) 276 2015, 270 5448
EMAIL: rmiranda@sdnnic.org.ni
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From larcon at sni.net Thu Nov 18 10:08:23 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: charcoaling request from Panama and Argentina
Message-ID: <v01540b03b459c967c4bf@[204.131.233.18]>

Rogerio:

Could you or Dr. Pimenta describe this technology at greater length
(size and type of container, its cost, method of firing such as top-down,
etc) ? Can you estimate more on the emissions. If there is flaring, do
you believe that the waster heat can be utilized?

>Dear Beatrriz and Francisco Tirado:
>
>The Unversity of Viçosa in Brazil has just developed a very simple
>equipment to manufacture charcoal in 8 hours, reducing time consumption,
>emissions and increasing efficiency. the equipment is very simple to
>operate and low cost. Please contact Dr. Alexandre Pimenta at
>(apimenta@mail.ufv.br) whch is responsable for this technology. He is
>currently working with PROLEÑA here in Nicaragua and in Honduras
>introducing this tech.
>
>regrads
>
>rogerio miranda
>
>.................................................................
>>.>>From: beatriz@latin1.net
>>>X-Sender: harrick@latin1.net
>>>Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:05:08 -0500
>>>To: larcon@sni.net
>>>Mime-Version: 1.0
>>>
>>>Dear Mr. Ronald:
>>>I am writing to see if you can orient us. We in Panama Republic Central
>>>America have some 30,000 hectares or more of teak plantations. In a study
>>>done in a canadian university the waste of teak is very good for charcoal
>>>and activated charcoal. Our country has no experience or data to do a
>>>research on the industry and on the supply and demand.
>>>
>>>My inquire is if you could help me in contacting us to manufactures of
>>>charcoal furnaces and if you could help us locate buyers for these charcoal?
>>>
>>>Thank you for your time
>>>Beatriz Harrick
>>>..........................................................................
>......
>The source message Francisco Mario Tirado <mtirado@imagine.com.ar>
>> to: woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru <woodcoal@mailbox.alkor.ru> =
>>12.11.1999 7:58
>> about: Svaliava Forest Chemical Factory
>>
>> Dear Dr.Yudkevitch:
>> Recently I was read your notices about the Svaliava Forest Chemical =
>>Factory.
>> At NW Argentine (Jujuy Province) there is an eucalyptus forest with =
>>300 brick kilns, but we have not any market for the charcoal yet (the =
>>steel factory near our charcoal enterprise is closed). =
>> I have interest in to contact some traders, investors and new =
>>technology developers for put in production our enterprise. The =
>>production capacity of our forest is now 2200 t/month (charcoal), and =
>>before 7 year forest plan is 4000 t/month.
>> Thanks, Francisco Mario Tirado
>> Alvear 687 piso 2 C 4600 S.S.Jujuy-Argentine tel/fax =
>>++54-388-4261679 mtirado@imagine.com.ar
>> =20
>
>
>Part C. Dr. Yuri's response.
>
>> Dear Dr.Tirado,=20
>> We have desighed and ventured the small plant for charcoal =
>>production ith capicity about 1000 tonns per year. Some details you can =
>>understand from the publication which I attached below. This manuscript =
>>wlii be published in Forest Energy Forum N 5.
>> Sincerely yours,
>> Yury Yudkevitch
>> =20
>> Stovers,
>> Probably, anybody can answer to Dr.Tirado additionally.
>> Yudkevitch
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Rogerio Carneiro de Miranda
> Asesor Tecnico Principal
> PROLEÑA/Nicaragua
> Apartado Postal C-321
> Managua, Nicaragua
> TELEFAX (505) 276 2015, 270 5448
> EMAIL: rmiranda@sdnnic.org.ni
>
><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
>http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
>Stoves Webpage
>http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
>For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
>http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From english at adan.kingston.net Thu Nov 18 20:34:39 1999
From: english at adan.kingston.net (*.English)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Activated Charcoal
Message-ID: <199911190139.UAA31333@adan.kingston.net>

Dear Stovers,
A drawing of a device for producing activated charcoal has been added
to the stoves webpage. Check for the link under the " New" section.

Alex English
RR 2 Odessa Ontario
Canada K0H 2H0
Tel 1-613-386-1927
Fax 1-613-386-1211

From larcon at sni.net Tue Nov 23 12:02:58 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding request on Drying sawdust and chips.
Message-ID: <v01540b00b46075b7e1f1@[204.131.233.8]>

Stovers: This request on drying is a little different from previous
requests. Sten is replying below to a request of mine for more background.
Those on the list who are in the drying business are encouraged to reply
either through the list or directly to Sten.

Sten: The main "stoves" person doing labor-intensive sawdust carbonization
(not drying) is Elsen Karstad - but we have been getting some returned
mail. (If anyone in Nairobi could alert Elsen, it would be appreciated).
Elsen's argument is that it is better to supply briquettes of charcoal,
rather than briquettes of
sawdust. Might any of your clients be interested in that also?

We have had considerable discussion in the past on this list of
briquetting for stove fuel. Could you tell us more about your experience
with briquettes (best sizes, costs, consumer preferences, etc) as used for
stoves.

Ron

>From: Sten Jorgensen <abc@abchansen.dk>
>Reply-To: "abc@abchansen.dk" <abc@abchansen.dk>
>To: "'larcon@sni.net'" <larcon@sni.net>
>Subject: VS: Drying sawdust and chips.
>Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:20:27 +0100
>Organization: ABC Hansen A/S
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>
>
>Dear Ron,
>Thankyou for the quick response to my mail. I got your e-mail address on
>your web site that I came across searching for information on this
>subject.
>Being very active in Africa at present with briquetting plants we receive
>inquiries for more cost effective solutions for drying of the sawdust and
>chip waste. We are working mainly with the sawmilling industry. The bigger
>companies that produce heat for there kilns are not a problem and they are
>also able to afford a system if needed. The problem lies with the smaller
>companies that need to be as cost effective as possible to make it a
>profitable operation. Many do not have heat, as they do air drying and then
>you find the wet off saw people that sell the timber wet and do not need
>drying for their products.
>The main species of timber is the pine species which is mainly soft and the
>eucaliptus species which you find the harder species on the high lying
>areas and the softer species on the lower lying areas. Then there are the
>very hard timbers of Africa that they use for furniture. Some of the bigger
>forestry companies are also thinking of briquetting the waste from the
>plantations after harvesting.
>The tonnage needed to be briquetted vary from 8 tons/day to 75tons/day. The
>moisture content is around 55-60% and needs to be brought down to 12-16%.
>I am searching for systems or tryed ways to offer the clients that need a
>solution to be more effective and productive if needed and are not able to
>afford an expensive system that would make there operation unprofitable.
>Any help or information in this area would be greatly appreciated.
>Regards
>
>Sten Jorgensen.
>
>

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From elk at net2000ke.com Wed Nov 24 13:52:45 1999
From: elk at net2000ke.com (Elsen Karstad)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Drying sawdust and chips.
Message-ID: <199911241902.WAA25056@net2000ke.com>

Sten Jorgensen is battling with the same problem I have. I too need to bring the sawdust moisture level down to 15% or lower in order to combust the volatiles (white smoke) produced during carbonisation. Sten needs low moisture levels in order to bind the sawdust & chips into briquettes.I have a heat source- the flared volatiles. The question is what is the most appropriate (simple & cheap) form of drier. Unless anyone has a better idea, I plan to make a batch-type perforated bed drier using forced hot air from beneath an initial load of, say, 500 kg (wet). What I don't like about this is the reliance on a fan to force the air through the mass of sawdust to be dried. I'd rather be off the grid. Natural convection and/or radiated heat just doesn't seem to be sufficient here.Suggestions anyone?elk~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Elsen L. Karstad , P.O. Box 24371 Nairobi Kenyaelk@net2000ke.com tel/fax (+ 254 2) 884437

From ticu at rdsor.ro Thu Nov 25 02:35:12 1999
From: ticu at rdsor.ro (Cornel Ticarat)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Retort for producing charcoal
Message-ID: <MAPI.Id.0016.00696375202020203030303430303034@MAPI.to.RFC822>

Dear "stovers",

I am interested in constructing a retort for producing charcoal and I need some advices from somebody who may be did it already.
I have planned to construct a retort having the following features:
- based on indirect heating; it means an inside chamber settled into the main chamber; that inside chamber contains the wood for carbonisation;
- container type (paralelipipedal shape, settled horizontal); transportable;
- fuel for starting heating: wood
- fuel for continuing and raising heating: the pyrolisis gases;
- very good fiber insulation;
- bach process;
- the kiln has at one of its ends the firebox ant at the opposite end it has the main dor and the chimney;
- not interested in getting any chemical liquids; only charcoal; that means I plan to burn all by-products resulting from pyrolising;
- capacity of the retort: for the begining - 2 cubic meters of wood;
- materials needed: steel plate; fiber insulatin; some pipes; gas burner for burning the pyrolisis gases;
The big problem to me is that I can only use fresly cutted wood for carbonisation, namely beech wood. That means I must pre-dry first the wood from an average 50% - 60% moisture content to 20% - 25% moisture content.
I want to know your opinion: It would be possible to pre-dry the wood first using for that the inside chamber? Does it means to maintain the temperature for evaporating of the water till there is no more water vapor? Will I get a good and uniform drying of the wood? I do not want to pre-dry the wood in an outside chamber, apart of the retort. Please let me know your experience on that or any other suggestions.
I plan that after the water vaporisation stops, to raise the temperature for continuing the proces.
I also need your opinion on the necesary time for each of the process phases, namely pre-drying and carbonisation phases.
I mention that I plan to cool the charcoal outside the retort, in a steel cooler. Do you have an ideea about the temperature at which I can take out the charcoal from the retort to cool it?
I also plan to use the flue gases coming out of the chimney for realise some pre-drying (7 to 10 percentage diminution of the moisture content). That imply this time another separate chamber. Do you have any experience on that?
Looking forward to hear from you any helpful sugestion and experiences.

My address:
Cornel Ticarat
Bd. Decebal, no. 5
Bl. P 18, ap. 13
Oradea, 3700
Romania
Tel: +40.59.160.372
Fax: +40.50.479.002
E-mail: ticu@rdsor.ro

Sincerely yours,

Cornel

From heat-win at cwcom.net Thu Nov 25 08:06:54 1999
From: heat-win at cwcom.net (T J Stubbing)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Drying sawdust and chips.
In-Reply-To: <199911241902.WAA25056@net2000ke.com>
Message-ID: <383D3713.764D07DD@cwcom.net>

Dear Elsen and Stovers,
Elsen Karstad wrote:
Sten
Jorgensen is battling with the same problem I have. I too need to bring
the sawdust moisture level down to 15% or lower in order to combust the
volatiles (white smoke) produced during carbonisation. Sten needs low moisture
levels in order to bind the sawdust & chips into briquettes.
Sten and I are corresponding on the drying of the sawdust and chips he
is able then to compact.
I
have a heat source- the flared volatiles.
These pyrolysis gases are produced after drying (the main energy
consumer) has taken place and pyrolysis has begun.
You can achieve use of those gases' energy for drying only if you have
two process chambers operating sequentially, one drying and one pyrolysing.
If you used a continuous process the same would apply because if you
dry and pyrolyse in, for example, one rotary louvre dryer (which by keeping
the sawdust/chips moving as the drying medium passes through them ensures
uniform heat and mass transfer), you couldn't avoid mixing water vapour
with the pyrolysis gases and if they are mixed those gases won't burn.
You would therefore need two rotary louvre dryers, one drying the wood
chips and/or sawdust in superheated steam and the second pyrolysing the
dried output and venting most of the pyrolysis gases into the first dryer's
stove from which some of the combustion gases would be diverted into the
second dryer's indirect heater to maintain the pyrolysis temperature.
The
question is what is the most appropriate (simple & cheap) form of drier.
Unless anyone has a better idea, I plan to make a batch-type perforated
bed drier using forced hot air from beneath an initial load of, say, 500
kg (wet).
The trouble with using air is that, once the sawdust is dry, if the air
is hot enough to pyrolyse it, it will burn it, i.e. the air will immediately
ignite the pyrolysis gases as happens in a stove. This is why we
are drying wood, etc., in recirculating superheated steam instead of air
and, once the volume of pyrolysis gases being generated has displaced and
replaced the machine's steam atmosphere, using recirculating pyrolysis
gases as the heat and mass transfer medium.
Air is excluded throughout.
During drying steam is vented and can be condensed to recover the evaporative
energy for re-use, e.g. to heat and air through-flow which can be used
to remove some of the moisture in a conventional pre-dryer. During
subsequent pyrolysis of the dried material, hot, virtually steam-free pyrolysis
gases are vented which can then be burnt easily and their combustion gases'
thermal energy used to dry the next load of moist material ready for it
in turn to be pyrolysed.
What
I don't like about this is the reliance on a fan to force the air through
the mass of sawdust to be dried. I'd rather be off the grid. Natural convection
and/or radiated heat just doesn't seem to be sufficient here.
With our test dryer we are "off grid" as we are using 12 v batteries to
power our recirculation fan and shall do the same with the 1,000 kg moist
weight capacity split log dryer/charcoal maker we have now designed and
intend to build. Heat is and will be supplied by a wood burning stove.
We are also looking into using a Stirling engine heated by our dryer's
indirect heater's flue gases to generate the electricity needed to operate
the fan, thus eliminanting the need for 12 v batteries.

Suggestions
anyone?
I've done my best to help and hope to do better once we have our larger
batch machine up and running and also a larger rotary louvre demonstration
dryer built and working.
elk
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Elsen
L. Karstad , P.O. Box 24371 Nairobi Kenya
elk@net2000ke.com
tel/fax (+ 254 2) 884437

I'm sorry this response is complicated, but I know of no simpler
way of achieving your objectives.
Regards,
Thomas
P.S. For those who are wondering about using superheated steam
as a drying medium and why it seems to work well, I am adding below an
extract from a recent 'sent' message:
"We know that it has twice the specific heat as air, so when a given
weight of it impinges on a moist
product it will remove twice as much moisture while using the same
fan power when its temperature
falls by the same number of degrees, but this doesn't explain why it
can dry things in as little as a
tenth of the time taken in a hot air dryer.
The explanation must therefore lie conceptually within the following:
1.In the absence of air there is no humid air boundary
layer to inhibit rapid evaporation.
2.As moist ambient temperature products enter our machines'
steam atmosphere, some of the
steam condenses on them, heating them rapidly
to 100 C. (The overall energy use effect of
this is, of course, neutral.)
3.At 100 C water has no surface tension, so droplets having
a very high heat transfer surface
area to volume ratio are more easily released
from the products into the recirculating
superheated steam atmosphere where they quickly
evaporate.
4.Water has a substantially lower viscosity at 100 C than
at the 30 to 40 C attained by product
moisture in a hot air dryer (that 30 to 40
C being the typical saturation temperature of the
impingement air in and efficient conventional
dryer). The lower viscosity assists 3. above and
also speeds up the movement of moisture from
within the product to its evaporative surface.
5.In the case of cellular products such as wood chips,
moisture trapped within unbroken airtight
cells remains there until the cells themselves
have been heated to slightly above 100 C so that
the pressure caused by the beginning of steam
formation ruptures the cells' walls and allows
the drying medium to impinge on their still
moist interiors. In the light of 3. and 4. above this
clearly occurs more rapidly when the drying
medium is superheated steam.
A fully equipped airless dryer has three heat exchangers:
a)    The indirect heater, which transfers
80 to 85% of the thermal energy from hot combustion

gases into the recirculating steam atmosphere while the remaining 15 to
20% emerges as flue
gases
from the heater),
b)    The product, to which all of
the thermal energy previously transferred into the

recirculating steam atmosphere except for the structural loss, i.e. the
thermal energy lost

through the dryer's thermal insulation (typically less than 10%) is transferred,
and
c)    The condenser in which, if the
condensate emerging from it is at the temperature of the

original moist product input, all of the thermal energy recieved by the
moisture

evaporated from the product is transferred to a cooling medium such as
air or water.
For the reasons set out in 1. to 5. above, an airless dryer is typically
not more than half the size of a
conventional hot air dryer with the same dried product output.
As a result, although a 'same size'
airless dryer costs around 35% more than a conventional machine, its
cost to output ratio is more
favourable when the drying time is halved, the scale of that advantage
increasing substantially if, for
example, drying is between three and ten times as fast. "

From larcon at sni.net Thu Nov 25 12:44:26 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding Dan Gill on making charcoal
Message-ID: <v01540b00b46325cba7ae@[204.131.233.32]>

(Ron:) 1. Dan forwards this message, already sent also to Cornel Ticarat.
2. This reminds me somewhat of the design proposed by Professor
Grover, which is toroidal, with no airflow throught hematerial, and the
combustible gases forced out near the bottom center, with combustion then
upward through the center of the donut-torus (and cooking on top).
3. The geometry for making charcoal in a stove of course deserves
repeating of course - with a small primary air flow moving upward in a can.
with secondary air flow and a chimney creating enough draft for a downward
traveling pyrolysis zone. (see the archives).

Ron

>
>I use the retort method for making charcoal for barbecue. I think it is
>the most simple method for making high quality charcoal. See my web page
>at: http://DanGill.tripod.com/Charmake.htm
>
>For the retort, 55 gal. drums are cheap, available and reusable. I plan
>to make a furnace which will hold 2 drums. I plan to have a removable
>top and a hoist to top load the drums. I use scrap wood for the fire and
>burn the pyrolisis gasses under the barrels rather than just flaring
>them off. I have found that I need to supplement the heat from pyrolysis
>gasses with some scrap wood throughout the burn. Perhaps a more
>efficient design would eliminate that need. If you use barrels with the
>snap-on retaining ring to secure the top, and a bung, you can run a pipe
>with a valve to the fire instead of making holes in the bottom of the
>drum. When the burn is complete, simply close the valve to exclude
>oxygen, remove the drums to cool and load in the next batch. The gasses
>and distillation products could also easily be captured and processed
>rather than burned.
>
>This method uses everything but the heat - which is significant! Some
>can be used to dry the next batch by simply placing the full drums on
>top of the furnace. I also plan to surround the furnace with a water
>jacket or copper pipes and store the hot water in a large tank for
>domestic heat. You could also make steam and use the power for
>electricity or some other use.
>
>Hope this helps and please keep me informed of your progress,
>
>Dan
>
>--
>Homepage: http://DanGill.tripod.com/
>Barbecue, curing and smoking meat, Woodworking and more
>
>Cornel Ticarat wrote:
>>
>> Dear "stovers",
>>
>> I am interested in constructing a retort for producing charcoal and I
>>need some advices from somebody who may be did it already.
>> I have planned to construct a retort having the following features:
>> - based on indirect heating; it means an inside chamber settled into the
>>main chamber; that inside chamber contains the wood for carbonisation;
>> - container type (paralelipipedal shape, settled horizontal); transportable;
>> - fuel for starting heating: wood
>> - fuel for continuing and raising heating: the pyrolisis gases;
>> - very good fiber insulation;
>> - bach process;
>> - the kiln has at one of its ends the firebox ant at the opposite end it
>>has the main dor and the chimney;
>> - not interested in getting any chemical liquids; only charcoal; that
>>means I plan to burn all by-products resulting from pyrolising;
>> - capacity of the retort: for the begining - 2 cubic meters of wood;
>> - materials needed: steel plate; fiber insulatin; some pipes; gas burner
>>for burning the pyrolisis gases;
>> The big problem to me is that I can only use fresly cutted wood for
>>carbonisation, namely beech wood. That means I must pre-dry first the
>>wood from an average 50% - 60% moisture content to 20% - 25% moisture
>>content.
>> I want to know your opinion: It would be possible to pre-dry the wood
>>first using for that the inside chamber? Does it means to maintain the
>>temperature for evaporating of the water till there is no more water
>>vapor? Will I get a good and uniform drying of the wood? I do not want to
>>pre-dry the wood in an outside chamber, apart of the retort. Please let
>>me know your experience on that or any other suggestions.
>> I plan that after the water vaporisation stops, to raise the temperature
>>for continuing the proces.
>> I also need your opinion on the necesary time for each of the process
>>phases, namely pre-drying and carbonisation phases.
>> I mention that I plan to cool the charcoal outside the retort, in a
>>steel cooler. Do you have an ideea about the temperature at which I can
>>take out the charcoal from the retort to cool it?
>> I also plan to use the flue gases coming out of the chimney for realise
>>some pre-drying (7 to 10 percentage diminution of the moisture content).
>>That imply this time another separate chamber. Do you have any experience
>>on that?
>> Looking forward to hear from you any helpful sugestion and experiences.
>>
>> My address:
>> Cornel Ticarat
>> Bd. Decebal, no. 5
>> Bl. P 18, ap. 13
>> Oradea, 3700
>> Romania
>> Tel: +40.59.160.372
>> Fax: +40.50.479.002
>> E-mail: ticu@rdsor.ro
>>
>> Sincerely yours,
>>
>> Cornel
>>
>> Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
>> http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
>> Stoves Webpage
>> http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
>> For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
>> http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm
>

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From karve at wmi.co.in Thu Nov 25 22:26:04 1999
From: karve at wmi.co.in (karve)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding Dan Gill on making charcoal
In-Reply-To: <v01540b00b46325cba7ae@[204.131.233.32]>
Message-ID: <383DFE3B.4409BD27@wmi.co.in>

Dear Mr. Ticarat and Stovers,
I was going to describe exactly the same system that Mr. Dan Gill has done. I
have used this for charring of sugarcane leaves. I think the biggest plus point of
the oven-retort system (from the point of view of commercial use) is that it
operates as a continuous batch process. Therefore, the size of the oven and the
number of retorts can be decided on the basis of money available; the volume of
wood/biomass to be charred will decide the number of batches. This also means that
you have the choice of making the kiln as a centrally located permanent structure,
with the wood/biomass being transported from other locations, or making a portable
kiln which can be taken to the source of wood/biomass. The second option is more
economical as far as loose biomass is concerned.
To cool the char, we pour water over the retort removed from the oven and then
empty the retort into a pail of water. Of course, this is o.k. for charred biomass
as it is in any case got to be wetted for conversion into char briquettes.
Regards,
Priyadarshini Karve

begin:vcard
n:Karve;Priyadarshini
tel;fax:-
tel;home:91 020 233258
tel;work:91 020 342217/4390348/4392284
x-mozilla-html:FALSE
url:http://members.tripod.com/ARTI_India/index.html
org:Appropriate Rural Technology Institue (ARTI)
version:2.1
email;internet:karve@wmi.co.in
title:Member
note:ARTI is an NGO undertaking research projects to study, develop, standardise, implement, commercialise and popularise innovative appropriate rural technologies with special emphasis on making traditional rural enterprises more profitable and generating new employment opportunities through introduction of novel business possibilities in rural areas.
adr;quoted-printable:;;2nd Floor, Maninee Apartments,=0D=0AOpposite Pure Foods Co., Dhayarigaon,;Pune,;Maharashtra;411 041;India
fn:Dr. Priyadarshini Karve
end:vcard

From larcon at sni.net Fri Nov 26 08:29:29 1999
From: larcon at sni.net (Ronal W. Larson)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Forwarding request: Charcoal as an Insulator?
Message-ID: <v01540b00b46439afb023@[204.131.233.32]>

Stovers: Anyone have specific values?

Lanny: Charcoal must of course not be used where it could have both a high
temperature and an air supply. Its advantages are pretty good mechanical
strength and little likelihood of deterioration (inedible) - some of its
reasons for preference by cooks.

Ron

>From: LannyH@aol.com
>Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 20:56:52 EST
>Subject: Charcoal as an Insulator
>To: owner-stoves@crest.org
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>
>Charcoal as an Insulator
>I noticed in the "Drawing For A Device for Activating charcoal" on the Stoves
>web page that the design uses insulating char. Is charcoal a good insulator?
>What is the R factor of charcoal?
>Lanny
>

Ronal W. Larson, PhD
21547 Mountsfield Dr.
Golden, CO 80401, USA
303/526-9629; FAX same with warning
larcon@sni.net

From Reedtb2 at cs.com Fri Nov 26 09:42:48 1999
From: Reedtb2 at cs.com (Reedtb2@cs.com)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Charcoal as an Insulator?
Message-ID: <0.c37e1cfa.256ff77f@cs.com>

Dear Stovers:

I have been pushing insulation for cookstoves for 3 years here with little
sign of interest from the group. So, GOOD QUESTION...

I don't know about charcoal, but you can make a very nice 3,000 C furnace
with a graphite tube, lots of current, and THERMATOMIC CARBON. Thermatomic
carbon looks like lampblack - very fine and dusty - and may actually be
lampblack. Nasty to handle, but great insulation. I didn't find anything on
the Web about it under that name.

The principle of operation of TH CA is that each granule is heated by
radiation, and returns hald that radiation back similar to the action of heat
shields. Whether charcoal would do that or not, I don't know.

Yours truly, TOM REED BEF

In a message dated 11/26/99 8:44:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, larcon@sni.net
writes:

<<
>Charcoal as an Insulator
>I noticed in the "Drawing For A Device for Activating charcoal" on the
Stoves
>web page that the design uses insulating char. Is charcoal a good insulator?
>What is the R factor of charcoal?
>Lanny >>
Stoves List SPONSORS and ARCHIVES:
http://solstice.crest.org/renewables/stoves-list-archive/
Stoves Webpage
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Stoves.html
For information about CHAMBERS STOVES
http://www.ikweb.com/enuff/public_html/Chamber.htm

From woodcoal at mailbox.alkor.ru Fri Nov 26 10:00:01 1999
From: woodcoal at mailbox.alkor.ru (Woodcoal)
Date: Tue Aug 31 21:36:26 2004
Subject: Drying sawdust and chips.
Message-ID: <01bf3827$6f416560$LocalHost@22>

Dear Elsen and all,
My teacher professor Pomerancev has elaborated a dryer for sawdust, swaft and
other similar materials 30 years back. The major principle is boiler grate bars
as ladders set under an angle of natural move of a material. The sawdusts do not
fail because the stages of a ladder are shifted inside. The gas quits from under
stages, and the sawdusts move over downwards under dead weight. The thickness of
a stratum on all altitude is identical, if the angle is selected correctly.
Capacity to be strewed of a material grows, when it dries. Section are cascaded.
Each lower section has more slanting location of stages, than upper. It can be
illustrated by a figure, but Dr. Ronal Larson asked to dispatch only text. The
dryers of such type work very stably. The heat flows can be staged in several
ways (it depends on initial damp) .
Sincerely yours, Yury Yudkevitch
(Russia)____________
Elsen Karstad to
stoves 11.24. 1999
About Drying sawdust and chips.
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">
Sten Jorgensen is battling with the same problem I have. I too need to bring the
sawdust moisture level down to 15% or lower in order to combust the
volatiles (white smoke) produced during carbonisation. Sten needs low
moisture levels in order to bind the sawdust & chips into
briquettes.I have a heat source- the flared volatiles. The question is
what is the most appropriate (simple & cheap) form of drier. Unless
anyone has a better idea, I plan to make a batch-type perforated bed drier
using forced hot air from beneath an initial load of, say, 500 kg (wet).
What I don't like about this is the reliance on a fan to force
the air through the mass of sawdust to be dried. I'd rather be off the grid.
Natural convection and/or radiated heat just doesn't seem to be sufficient
here.Suggestions anyone?elk~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Elsen L. Karstad , P.O. Box
24371 Nairobi Kenyaelk@net2000ke.com tel/fax (+ 254 2)
884437

BioEnergy Lists: Improved Biomass Cooking Stoves

November 1999 Biomass Cooking Stoves Archive