[Terrapreta] Ponder the Maunder

[Kevin Chisholm]

Dear Lou

lou gold wrote:
> lots of evidence that does not persuade you. but i'm not trying to 
> persuade you so there is no need to go into it. others have covered it 
> ad nauseum.

Evidence has been provided to support both Global Warming and Global 
Cooling. I know that that we had Global Warming and Global Cooling long 
before Man was impacting on the environment. I know that Mother Nature 
is awesome in Her power, and I respect that she may be "doing her thing" 
without significant help from us, and that perhaps we are not able to 
contravene her wishes.
>
> but, if you have such doubts about the values of putting carbon into 
> the soils why are you here?

I am interested in Terra Preta as a "Proven Agricultural Paradigm." This 
thread is attempting to use Terra Preta as an "Atmospheric Improvement 
Method." That is very much a different thread than what the Indians of 
Yore had in mind.

You asked if we thought you were preaching. I thought you were, for the 
listed reasons. :-)

To answer your specific question, I am here to learn and to help. I am 
not here to agree or disagree.

Best wishes,

Kevin


>
> On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 11:49 PM, Kevin Chisholm 
> <kchisholm at ca.inter.net <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>> wrote:
>
>     Dear Lou
>
>
>     lou gold wrote:
>
>         Hi Mark,
>
>         It will make it simple.
>
>         I also am concerned about increasing soil productivity. I
>         notice soil productivity was often lost because best practices
>         were not the most profitable practices. So I am looking for a
>         way to finance a very large investment in returning carbon to
>         the soil. I believe that the link to global warming may be the
>         necessary link to mobilize political will for such an
>         investment. I see that the mid-west farm lobby already
>         successfully used this argument to rationalize corn ethanol. I
>         don't like this way so I (we really) am trying to offer a
>         better carbon negative way that will both improve soil
>         fertility and and sequester carbon.
>
>         Do you feel that I'm preaching?
>
>
>     Well, Preachers advocate action based on belief with no evidence.
>     :-) What evidence do we have that the Global Climate Change that
>     seems to be upon is is headed toward Global Warming, rather than
>     Global Cooling? What evidence do we have that Terra Preta is
>     worthwhile as an agricultural additive in temperate climate
>     agriculture? What evidence do we have that the present Climate is
>     being dominated by anthropogenic factors, and that the actions of
>     Man can reverse the present GCC trend toward either Global Worming
>     or Global Cooling?
>
>     Best wishes,
>
>     Kevin
>
>
>         lou
>
>
>         On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Mark Ludlow <mark at ludlow.com
>         <mailto:mark at ludlow.com> <mailto:mark at ludlow.com
>         <mailto:mark at ludlow.com>>> wrote:
>
>            Hi Lou,
>
>            
>            I can't speak for others, but I believe, personally, that
>         framing
>            the discussion around carbon sequestration is a big
>         mistake. Even
>            today, the world is experiencing rapidly escalating food prices
>            and the importance of making agriculture more sustainable and
>            productive may well affect more people in this century than
>         GHG.
>
>            
>            My personal interest is sparked by the notion that char
>         adds to or
>            at least helps to maintain soil fertility. It also will
>         sequester
>            carbon and it may also immobilize certain toxic substances; all
>            positives, but all secondary to the improvement of soil
>         fertility
>            and the virtual rebuilding of soils in many areas of the world.
>
>            
>            The discussion of late, seeming to imply some form of New World
>            Order as a solution for Global Warming, makes me at least a
>         little
>            nervous and I can see that it has a similar effect on at
>         least a
>            few others. Already, leaders of this way of viewing the
>         future are
>            informing members of the list what ideas are politically
>         correct
>            and which are anathematic. I don't remember being polled…
>
>            
>            If I want to be preached to, I'll try to find a preacher
>         who's a
>            snake handler, not just a snake oil salesman, if for no other
>            reason than shear entertainment value. But actually, I would
>            rather believe that every man is his own best preacher and that
>            all of the jawboning, petty back-and-forth, and racing to
>         gain the
>            moral high ground does little to further the "cause" of
>         Terra Preta.
>
>            
>            Best regards,
>
>            Mark
>
>            
>            
>