[Terrapreta] C02 Tree Capture – how much carbon dioxide do trees really capture?

[Kevin Chisholm]

Dear Lou
lou gold wrote:
> Hey Brother,
>
> You are picking I fight.
> I am saying no thanks.
You may choose to think that I am attacking you. I am simply trying to 
find out where you are coming from and what you stand for. You seem 
reluctant to tell us. I can only conclude that you have a second agenda, 
or that your thoughts are not yet congealed. Perhaps I am wrong. Perhaps 
others see your posts as being helpful and supportive of TP. I don't. I 
see you preferring not to use trees for char. What am I missing?

At any rate, what you are posting on the TP list is all good stuff in 
its own right... Permaculture, Sustainability, Diversity, etc. No 
problem with that!! I would welcome your thoughts on how this can be 
integrated with the constructive promotion of the more widespread use of TP.

Best wishes,

Kevin

>
> hugs,
>
> lou
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 12:28 PM, Kevin Chisholm <kchisholm at ca.inter.net 
> <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>> wrote:
>
>     Dear Loulou gold wrote:
>     > Oooops, I missed the "wood for charcoal question". This one is
>     complex
>     > and there is no way I can do it justice.
>     Very true. The corollary of which is that you do "wood for charcoal" a
>     great injustice when you practically advocate that trees not be
>     used for
>     charcoal and TP.
>     > Here are just a few considerations...
>     >
>     > 1. Again, it is most paramount that primary forests are not cut for
>     > this purpose.
>     What do you mean by a "primary forest?" Is a conversion cut of an
>     existing stand permissable to Tree Huggers?
>     >
>     > 2. Here in Brazil, eucalyptus is grown for charcoal on a huge scale.
>     > It even fuels the iron foundries. This is what you do when there
>     is no
>     > cheap coal available. I am told told that there are better and worse
>     > ways to do it. Cutting primary forests for the first round of
>     charcoal
>     > and replacing them with eucalyptus plantations is a bad way. Vast
>     > eucalyptus monocultures are a bad way. Placing eucalyptus stands as
>     > one of several crops in a diversified farming operation is a
>     good way.
>     What are your thoughts on "patchwork monoculture?"
>     >
>     > 3. I'm very uneasy about the new ethanol from cellulose approach
>     with
>     > genetically modified trees but I'm not qualified to have a real
>     > intelligent judgment here.
>     OK... this is the TP list. Lets stick to issues relating to getting C
>     from Trees for TP.
>     >
>     > 4, I would vastly prefer to see wood wastes go into producing
>     char for
>     > the soil instead of for fuel or co-generation.
>     This is the TP list. We are not talking about char for fuel, but
>     rather,
>     char for TP.
>     >
>     > OK, that's a start -- barely scratches the surface I'm sure.
>     So, how does the Tree Hugger fit with tree wood being used for TP?
>
>     Kevin
>     >
>     > hugs,   lou
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > On Dec 5, 2007 11:14 AM, lou gold <lou.gold at gmail.com
>     <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>
>     > <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>>> wrote:
>     >
>     >     Hmmm. Did ya watch the video? It clearly states that soil and
>     >     water are the main limiting factors. Therefore, if you want to
>     >     have plants and trees pulling CO2 out of the atmosphere, you
>     >     better work on soil fertility and its ability to retain water.
>     >     Perfect tasks for TP.
>     >
>     >     I don't consider myself as a spokesperson for the tree-huggers.
>     >     Actually, across the past year, Terra Preta maybe
>     transforming my
>     >     awareness and ideology more toward conscious farming. The main
>     >     inspiration of TP for me is that the El Dorado story says that
>     >     once there was a civilization of high density populations living
>     >     in harmony with nature and  forests. This is very contrary
>     to the
>     >     history of western civilization which advanced via
>     deforestation.
>     >     Indeed, it is so different that it might constitute a vitally
>     >     necessary paradigm shift and carry us from the issues of
>     scarcity
>     >     into the joys of abundance. I don't know that this is true. I
>     >     suspect it might be. I want to find out.
>     >
>     >     I believe strongly that we need to stop logging any more intact
>     >     primary forests. A complete halt is unlikely. All steps of
>     avoided
>     >     or reduced deforestation need to be rewarded. Carbon credits
>     are a
>     >     good way.
>     >
>     >     As far as as intelligent forest management is concerned, I
>     >     recommend that you check out the Menominee Tribal Forest
>     which has
>     >     won many awards and recognitions.
>     >     http://www.menominee.edu/sdi/RAndEMission.html
>     >     < http://www.menominee.edu/sdi/RAndEMission.html>
>     >
>     >     hugs,
>     >
>     >     lou
>     >
>     >
>     >     On Dec 5, 2007 10:12 AM, Kevin Chisholm
>     <kchisholm at ca.inter.net <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>
>     >     <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net
>     <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>> > wrote:
>     >
>     >         Dear David and Lou
>     >
>     >         Most of us on the Terra Preta List have an "environmentally
>     >         responsible
>     >         leaning", a sense of beauty, and an appreciation of the good
>     >         things a
>     >         tree can do. However, what I see is that extremism seldom
>     >         works in an
>     >         optimal manner. Mother Nature is smart, and she seems to
>     favor
>     >         diversity. It is absolutely impossible for Man to exist on
>     >         this Earth
>     >         without interacting with Mother Nature. Either we get
>     Divorced
>     >         and one
>     >         of us leaves, or we find ways that we can live on Earth in a
>     >         sustainable
>     >         basis. Otherwise, one of us will die, and the other will be
>     >         seriously
>     >         injured.
>     >
>     >         As Representatives of our "Resident Tree Huggers", what
>     would
>     >         you and
>     >         David recommend as tree cutting guidelines  acceptable
>     to the
>     >         Tree Huggers?
>     >
>     >         Under what conditions would the Tree Hugging Community agree
>     >         to using
>     >         wood as a source of carbon for Terra Preta?
>     >
>     >         Kevin
>     >
>     >         lou gold wrote:
>     >         > Good Morning to All,
>     >         >
>     >         > Another good one from ABC.
>     >         > http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/s1901661.htm
>     >         >
>     >         > I draw the lesson that if one wants trees and other plants
>     >         to capture
>     >         > carbon it's best to work on renewing the soil.
>     >         >
>     >         > hugs,   lou
>     >         >
>     >         >
>     >         >
>     >        
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     >         >
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>     >
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     >     --
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>     >
>     >
>     >
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>     > --
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>
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