[Terrapreta] C02 Tree Capture – or miscanthus...

[lou gold]

Gerrit,

You know that ecosystem. Do you see any chance of building in some kind of
production of char -- perhaps subsidized by carbon credits -- for local soil
amendment? Might it be possible to build a mixed product into the system --
with a 10-20% subsidized sequestration tithe back into the earth? I'm
pulling the numbers out of thin air just to communicate the concept. Could
be a mix built into any crop system, including trees headed for ethanol.

What do you think?

lou

On Dec 5, 2007 8:21 PM, Gerald Van Koeverden <vnkvrdn at yahoo.ca> wrote:

> Lou,
> Here in Canada, it seems that researchers have practically given up on
> trees like poplar and willow for fuel (7-10 tons odm/acre) for our temperate
> climate;  switchgrass hasn't caught on either.  At present, the local buzz
> is about cold-tolerant varieties of miscanthus - 15 tons odm/acre.  Either
> for directly heating vegetable greenhouses or for the 'imminent'(?)
>  cellulose-to-ethanol route...  Miscnathus stands can apparently produce for
> 30 years after one planting with virtually no fertilization.
>
> Of course, this wouldn't produce charcoal, unless one is using pyrolysis
> as the treatment process.  But even then, would first, the quality of char
> produced be good enough for long-term soil amendment? and secondly, the char
> would probably be sold for an industrial application anyways to maximize
> returns from investment...
>
> The only advantage of planting miscanthus for energy, would be its
> carbon-neutral status...
>
> Gerrit
>
> On 5-Dec-07, at 8:39 AM, lou gold wrote:
>
> Oooops, I missed the "wood for charcoal question". This one is complex and
> there is no way I can do it justice. Here are just a few considerations...
>
> 1. Again, it is most paramount that primary forests are not cut for this
> purpose.
>
> 2. Here in Brazil, eucalyptus is grown for charcoal on a huge scale. It
> even fuels the iron foundries. This is what you do when there is no cheap
> coal available. I am told told that there are better and worse ways to do
> it. Cutting primary forests for the first round of charcoal and replacing
> them with eucalyptus plantations is a bad way. Vast eucalyptus monocultures
> are a bad way. Placing eucalyptus stands as one of several crops in a
> diversified farming operation is a good way.
>
> 3. I'm very uneasy about the new ethanol from cellulose approach with
> genetically modified trees but I'm not qualified to have a real intelligent
> judgment here.
>
> 4, I would vastly prefer to see wood wastes go into producing char for the
> soil instead of for fuel or co-generation.
>
> OK, that's a start -- barely scratches the surface I'm sure.
>
> hugs,   lou
>
>
>
> On Dec 5, 2007 11:14 AM, lou gold <lou.gold at gmail.com > wrote:
>
> > Hmmm. Did ya watch the video? It clearly states that soil and water are
> > the main limiting factors. Therefore, if you want to have plants and trees
> > pulling CO2 out of the atmosphere, you better work on soil fertility and its
> > ability to retain water. Perfect tasks for TP.
> >
> > I don't consider myself as a spokesperson for the tree-huggers.
> > Actually, across the past year, Terra Preta maybe transforming my awareness
> > and ideology more toward conscious farming. The main inspiration of TP for
> > me is that the El Dorado story says that once there was a civilization of
> > high density populations living in harmony with nature and  forests. This is
> > very contrary to the history of western civilization which advanced via
> > deforestation. Indeed, it is so different that it might constitute a vitally
> > necessary paradigm shift and carry us from the issues of scarcity into the
> > joys of abundance. I don't know that this is true. I suspect it might be. I
> > want to find out.
> >
> > I believe strongly that we need to stop logging any more intact primary
> > forests. A complete halt is unlikely. All steps of avoided or reduced
> > deforestation need to be rewarded. Carbon credits are a good way.
> >
> > As far as as intelligent forest management is concerned, I recommend
> > that you check out the Menominee Tribal Forest which has won many awards and
> > recognitions. http://www.menominee.edu/sdi/RAndEMission.html
> >
> > hugs,
> >
> > lou
> >
> >
> > On Dec 5, 2007 10:12 AM, Kevin Chisholm <kchisholm at ca.inter.net > wrote:
> >
> > > Dear David and Lou
> > >
> > > Most of us on the Terra Preta List have an "environmentally
> > > responsible
> > > leaning", a sense of beauty, and an appreciation of the good things a
> > > tree can do. However, what I see is that extremism seldom works in an
> > > optimal manner. Mother Nature is smart, and she seems to favor
> > > diversity. It is absolutely impossible for Man to exist on this Earth
> > > without interacting with Mother Nature. Either we get Divorced and one
> > > of us leaves, or we find ways that we can live on Earth in a
> > > sustainable
> > > basis. Otherwise, one of us will die, and the other will be seriously
> > > injured.
> > >
> > > As Representatives of our "Resident Tree Huggers", what would you and
> > > David recommend as tree cutting guidelines  acceptable to the Tree
> > > Huggers?
> > >
> > > Under what conditions would the Tree Hugging Community agree to using
> > > wood as a source of carbon for Terra Preta?
> > >
> > > Kevin
> > >
> > > lou gold wrote:
> > > > Good Morning to All,
> > > >
> > > > Another good one from ABC.
> > > > http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/s1901661.htm
> > > >
> > > > I draw the lesson that if one wants trees and other plants to
> > > capture
> > > > carbon it's best to work on renewing the soil.
> > > >
> > > > hugs,   lou
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > http://lougold.blogspot.com/
> >  http://www.flickr.com/photos/visionshare/sets/
>
>
>
>
> --
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> http://www.flickr.com/photos/visionshare/sets/
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-- 
http://lougold.blogspot.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/visionshare/sets/
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