[Terrapreta] Terra Preta Specifications
Sean K. Barry
sean.barry at juno.com
Fri Apr 18 23:37:32 CDT 2008
Hi Kevin,
I can, ... simply "put a bunch of char in the soil, and hope for the best." I will rely on others (more competent than I in soil science research) to research the best kind of charcoal to use and the best way to apply it.
Regards,
SKB
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin Chisholm<mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>
To: lou gold<mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>
Cc: Sean K. Barry<mailto:sean.barry at juno.com> ; Michael Bailes<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com> ; terrapreta<mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: Terra Preta Specifications
Dear Lou
lou gold wrote:
> Hi Kevin,
>
> I just re-read Scott Bidstrup's, Saving the Planet While Saving the
> Farm. I recommend it to you/. (maybe you already know it?)
> http://www.bidstrup.com/carbon.htm<http://www.bidstrup.com/carbon.htm>
> /
Thanks very much. A very good article.
> /
> I'm sure that many of the details need to be better understood and
> worked out but I think he lays down a pretty decent basic picture.
> Also, my suspicion is that by Terra Preta Nova Sean simply means
> carbonization of the soil along with some other useful amendments and
> good practices but I'll let him speak for himself.
> /
I see his general concept, but in order to take action, one needs to do
something specific. Without guidance that would come from a recipe or
specifications, we would all be going in different directions, and we
could expect very mixed results. We can't simply "put a bunch of char in
the soil, and hope for the best." Having a recipe or specification would
result in much more good being accomplished.
Best wishes,
Kevin
> /
> hugs,
>
> lou
> /
> On Fri, Apr 18, 2008 at 11:25 PM, Kevin Chisholm
> <kchisholm at ca.inter.net<mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net> <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net<mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>>> wrote:
>
> Dear Sean
>
> So that we are all on the same page, could you kindly define or
> describe "Terra Preta Nova"?
>
> Could you provide a "Recipe", or a "Specification" so that if we,
> in various parts of the world made some, we would have a product
> that would be comparable?
>
> With all that has been written, I still don't know what Terra
> Preta is, other than the trivial description of "Black earth with
> pottery shards." Could you, or anyone on the List provide a
> similar "Recipe" or "Specification" for "Old Terra Preta"? Perhaps
> there is a URL with sufficient detail such that one could make a
> batch of Terra Preta from it.
>
> You suggest making a lot of charcoal and putting it into lots of
> soil now.What would you recommend as the addition rate, for
> example, in pounds per square foot, or kG per square meter, etc?
> Is there anything else that should be added along with teh charcoal?
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Kevin
>
>
> Sean K. Barry wrote:
>
> Hi Lou, Michael, et al,
> It would be interesting to fell a hardwood in the rainforest
> now, in a muddy area, with girdling and fire alone? Just to
> clear an area for sunlight? With no stone or metal tools?
> Then light it a fire on the ground (how?, in parts?) and bury
> it? But to what end would we do this? To replicate what
> ancient Amazonians did? If that is what they did? For what
> reason would we do this? Do you see my point?
> I do not think we want to consider harvesting old growth
> forests anyway now, to make charcoal to put into Terra Preta
> Nova soils. No one hear thinks that is what needs be done and
> it's because the ancients did it that way. I think the most
> logical source of biomass feedstock for pyrolysis/gasification
> into charcoal and usable energy is biomass that is likely to
> decay anyway. Waste biomass (RFS, MSW, etc) and annual growth
> that falls and decays annually anyway from amongst both crops
> and other natural plants. Biomass forms that grow higher tons
> of "fixed Carbon" per hectare (fC ha-1) of usable for
> pyrolysis feedstock are potential energy crops. Charcoal
> application, fertilizer amendments, and sufficient watering
> into energy crop soils might have feedbacks that enhance both
> fC ha-1 yields and soil carbon sequestration rates.
> Forward looking models for development of Terra Preta Nova,
> which includes conversion of biomass to charcoal and
> harvesting usable bio-energy, need to consider all charcoal
> uses (agricultural benefits/food production enhancement,
> carbon sequestration, energy replacement, etc) and high
> charcoal production rates needed very soon for some of those
> uses. Specifically, charcoal made for charcoal-in-soil carbon
> sequestration will requires perhaps several billion tons per
> year (Gt yr-1) of charcoal production within 10-25 years, I
> suppose?
> Agriculture interest seem as if they cannot figure out a way
> how to use it?, or where, or a reason to do making and using
> anything near several Gt yr-1 of charcoal right now. No body
> has the "Terra Preta de Indio" recipe and the farmers are all
> saying that "... unless it is a proven, economically viable,
> agriculturally more productive, profitable benefit product for
> me to use, than I'll never use it or do it!" SO, there is not
> a market for any Gt yr-1 of charcoal there, right? Now what
> do we do?
> I think the answer to, "Now what do we do?", is to start
> making charcoal for Terra Preta Nova development now, anyway.
> Do it like we're going to turn the whole world into a Terra
> Preta soiled landform, a planet sized TP garden! We put
> charcoal into soil to work now on preventing further GW and
> GCC problems later and for the agricultural benefits that we
> will learn about along the way. We will need to do something
> like this eventually, anyway, right? We might as well get
> started. It's going to take years, perhaps more than a
> century, to even begin to push back a little against where the
> climate is headed now.
> There is promise, too, that left untended, GCC could move
> into an era of positive feedbacks: Methyl hydrate releases
> (thawed CH4) and CO2 releases from the oceans (plant and
> animal die offs), Methane gas-CH4 releases from permafrost
> wetlands in the northern former Soviet Union, northern Canada
> and Alaska, increased N2O concentrations from continued
> industrial fertilizer use, adiabatic heating due to less
> snow/ice cover on land and oceans, etc. These positive
> feedbacks will accelerate the warming and need to be avoided.
> I think we can make positive feedbacks work now to our
> advantage, too, in making "Terra Preta Nova", if we increase
> the scale of our operations. Already using MSW and
> agricultural residues, that decay anyway, as feedstock for
> charcoal is a positive feedback in our desired direction
> (removing CO2 from the atmosphere). It removes some CO2 now
> and prevents further CO2 cycling into and out of the
> atmosphere for many years into the future. Improved soils
> under charcoal and bio-energy producing crops is another
> potential large feedback. Overall increased plant growth and
> consequent CO2 uptake by plants planted in Terra Preta Nova
> soils, could also prove to be a large positive feedback
> towards and help in lowering the CO2 concentration in the
> atmosphere at a faster rate.
> Let's make lots of charcoal and put it into lots of soil now!
> Regards,
> SKB
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* lou gold <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com<mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>
> <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com<mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>>>
> *To:* Michael Bailes <mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>
> <mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>>>
> *Cc:* terra pretta group
> <mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org<mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
> <mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org<mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>>>
> *Sent:* Friday, April 18, 2008 2:11 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Terrapreta] Earthen Kilns Conjecture
>
> I'm not sure of the relevance either but I want to assure
> you that
> nothing amazing is going on. The life and structure of a large
> tree is concentrated in the outer layers. Hollow trees are
> quite
> natural.
>
> On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 10:35 PM, Michael Bailes
> <michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>
> <mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>>
> <mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>
> <mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>>>> wrote:
>
> Australian Aboriginals encouraged the burning of large
> gums so
> that a hollow was made though the centre of the gum.
> Amazingly gums survive this traeatment and live on.
> The hollows became great nesting places for native
> animals and
> therefore convenient larders for fresh food for the
> aborigines.
>
> I am not sure how this is relevant
> But it would be interesting to set alight to a rainforest
> hardwood tree to see if it formed ash or charcoal.
> Michael B
>
> __
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> http://lougold.blogspot.com<http://lougold.blogspot.com/>
> http://flickr.com/visionshare/sets<http://flickr.com/visionshare/sets>
> http://youtube.com/my_videos<http://youtube.com/my_videos>
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