[Terrapreta] Present and Future Benefits of TP

[lou gold]

Good question.
Write to them and ask.

On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 4:56 PM, Chuck Yokota <
cyokota at innovativeenergyinc.com> wrote:

>  Hi Lou and Sean,
>
>
>
> Does the Biochar Fund actually have the technology developed to actually
> provide a pyrolysis plant/electric generator as described?  If so, I want
> one; but if they expect to develop one, they will run into those technical
> hurdles, as the folks on the gasifier list know well.
>
>
>
> Chuck
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* terrapreta-bounces at bioenergylists.org [mailto:
> terrapreta-bounces at bioenergylists.org] *On Behalf Of *Sean K. Barry
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 26, 2008 10:49 AM
> *To:* lou gold
> *Cc:* terrapreta
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Terrapreta] Present and Future Benefits of TP
>
>
>
> Hi Lou,
>
>
>
> This is a fantastic site you've referred me to.  I don't mean to imply
> that considerations for Methane-CH4 emissions should prevent
> "slash-and-char" as opposed to wider scale "slash-and-burn".  From that site
> http://biocharfund.com site ...
>
>
>
> What is more, the production of biochar in village-scale pyrolysis plants
> is coupled to the *generation of carbon-**negative* *electricity*, making
> renewable, low-carbon and decentralised energy services available to rural
> communities currently without access to modern energy.
>
>
>
> The site speaks of the kind of pyrolysis plants, that I think are needed
> to make charcoal cleanly (sans Methane-CH4 emissions).  The site mentions
> many of the things I have been talking about.  There are several technical
> hurdles to implement these types of systems.  It has to be realized, too,
> that even biomass is finite and we can harvest only so much charcoal and/or
> energy from it.  Without significant amounts of biomass, there will be
> neither charcoal, nor energy to be had.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> SKB
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>
> *From:* lou gold <lou.gold at gmail.com>
>
> *To:* Sean K. Barry <sean.barry at juno.com>
>
> *Cc:* Richard Haard <richrd at nas.com> ; terrapreta<terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 26, 2008 10:24 AM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Terrapreta] Present and Future Benefits of TP
>
>
>
> Hi Sean,
>
> I'm jumping into this in the middle without carefully following the
> thread. Apologies if I am missing your point.
>
> The emphasis on "slash and char" is in the context of replacing the "slash
> and burn" techniques used by millions of subsistence farmers who live along
> the frontiers of tropical deforestation and in other poverty-stricken and
> soil-depleted  areas. I don't know how appropriate a term this would be in
> the modern industrial farming scene. With regard to the frontiers of
> tropical deforestation it could have a HUGE impact.
>
> This is why http://biocharfund.com//index.php<http://biocharfund.com/index.php>was created.
>
> Again, apologies if I've missed your meanings.
>
> lou
>
> On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 11:56 AM, Sean K. Barry <sean.barry at juno.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Richard,
>
>
>
> Perhaps I have not mentioned "slash-and-char" directly in those terms.  My
> concept of "in-situ" pyrolysis is the closest I would be to that, I think.
> Open field "slash-and-char" is not exactly what is needed to combat the
> atmospheric problems.  Emissions from open field "slash-and-char" are the
> problem.
>
>
>
> There were some things I wanted to ask you about.  How does charcoal (+
> pottery?) help soil hold nutrients better?  To see how TP soils work,
> shouldn't we be looking at that more?  If anyone makes charcoal on and
> applies it on one site, then this is "in-situ".  If instead anyone makes
> charcoal on one and more sites, all applied to another site, then the latter
> site receives the concentration of nutrients (in-the-charcoal) from the
> other sites.  Might  concentrating it on another site might be the important
> part of what the Amazonians did when making their Terra Preta?
>
>
>
> Importing and concentrating nutrients from a large area onto a smaller one
> must clearly bring more nutrients into that soil bank?  Does/would the build
> up of microorganisms and the increase in nutrient holding/delivering
> capacity (CEC) take time to develop in the soil?  Does/would it involve
> certain crop rotations or a continued annual series of inputs?  There is a
> real kind of "investment" quality to attempting to form Terra Preta soils, I
> think.  It also seems like it requires continued investments to really
> work.  We're trying to bank the stores of carbon, nutrients, and
> microorganisms (containing carbon).  All of this, to build on the kinds of
> agricultural productivity we can get out of these TP plots/banks (our
> interests and dividends).
>
>
>
> Lastly, the problem of rising GHG in the atmosphere means being very
> careful about GHG emissions.  We DO NEED to pyrolize GIGATONS biomass,
> making charcoal, and put it into the ground, ASAP.  We cannot let ~3-10% of
> the original carbon in that biomass escape into the atmosphere as
> Methane-CH4 and sequester less than 50% of the carbon when we pyrolyze the
> biomass (as happens in an open pit).  That will not work in the grand scale,
> to fix the problems in the atmosphere, even if we buried all of the GIGATONS
> of charcoal we made.
>
>
>
> I know I am beating the crap out of this point.  But it is critical to any
> plan that uses Terra Preta for climate amelioration needs to take it into
> account.  Others methods just don't hunt.  The slash-and-char concept seems
> strictly "in-situ" to me.  Does or will transport of charcoal from site to
> site become important in the formation of Terra Preta soils?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> SKB
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>
> *From:* Richard Haard <richrd at nas.com>
>
> *To:* Sean K. Barry <sean.barry at juno.com>
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 26, 2008 1:06 AM
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Terrapreta] Present and Future Benefits of TP
>
>
>
> ...
>
>
>
> Target atmospheric CO2: Where should humanity aim?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Terrapreta mailing list
> Terrapreta at bioenergylists.org
> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/biochar/
> http://terrapreta.bioenergylists.org
> http://info.bioenergylists.org
>
>
>
>
> --
> http://lougold.blogspot.com
> http://flickr.com/visionshare/sets
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Terrapreta mailing list
> Terrapreta at bioenergylists.org
> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/biochar/
> http://terrapreta.bioenergylists.org
> http://info.bioenergylists.org
>



-- 
http://lougold.blogspot.com
http://flickr.com/visionshare/sets
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: /attachments/20080326/a89c5d75/attachment.html