[Terrapreta] Topic #3 - charcoal production: pulverizing charcoal

Sean K. Barry sean.barry at juno.com
Mon May 19 21:39:36 CDT 2008

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Hi Michael, Greg, Roy, et al.,

This is great! We are on topic here, right? Pulverizing charcoal that is produced for charcoal-in-soil use is part of the topical element #3: charcoal production, right? I just don't want the topic police to be messing with us. DO YOU!?

Here are some questions, though? Why pulverize it? I suppose it might have a larger amount of surface area per kilogram as a result. But, could it be pulverized too much? I think that the original Terra Preta charcoal had a 3mm minus size to it, but I am not sure that occurred before or after it was made and put into the soil. Maybe it just breaks up with cultivation? Pulverizing the char will impart some cost, either to mince up the feedstock or the charcoal. Agua Das and Tom Reed at the Biomass Energy Foundation did do some studies on particle size of feedstock, when it comes to efficiency of gasification, but not of charcoal product. I think Dynamotive , which does Fast Pyrolysis, for gas, found that much smaller feedstock particle sizes results in more gas and less char product.

If we said that the least expensive way to make charcoal was minimal processing of the feedstock, then pulverizing the charcoal product might be better than pulverizing the feedstock. But, then this goes back to analysis of what the "best" particle size was for the charcoal, when used as a soil amendment.

Should I say field study? Larry Williams and Richard Haard didn't pulverize the charcoal they used at 4CN, I don't think. They just pushed it around some and made bucket dumps onto the ground, I thought. I seem to remember some pictures of Richard all covered in charcoal dust, wearing a dust mask, and so I do think that he did some experimentation with pulverizing charcoal, though. Maybe they will chime in and let us know what they think about charcoal lump size?

Edward Someus and Richard both spoke about applying charcoal as a side band with seeding operations. That discussion seemed to imply that fine grained charcoal was required (to get it through the seed drill injectors?).

Regards,

SKB

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Bailes<mailto:michaelangelica at gmail.com>
To: Terra Preta<mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 7:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Terrapreta] pulverizing charcoal

With rice hull char and chicken shit you don't have problems of pulverising char.

Could someone please import some of those huge "Mortar and pestles" used to smash grain in Africa?
m

2008/5/20 Greg and April <gregandapril at earthlink.net<mailto:gregandapril at earthlink.net>>:

The cement mixer can be modified to be powered with animal or human power if need be - I have seen a couple, one had a crank, the other was coupled to a treadmill.

Still you didn't ask all the questions like, what is the liner made of? How often are you going to have to replace it? Where are all the clamps going to come from, and how much are they going to cost?

Tell you what, why don't you have a pulverizing party, and tell us how it went - I think you are going to have a hard time even getting the liner, and when you do, I know that sticker shock is going to hit harder than you think.

Greg H.

----- Original Message -----
From: Roy Lent<mailto:rwlent at gmail.com>
To: terrapreta at bioenergylists.org<mailto:terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 17:54
Subject: Re: [Terrapreta] pulverizing charcoal

What does the cement mixer run on? There are many ways to do this by using petroleum. Of course, those ways release more carbon to the atmosphere than the char preserves in the soil. In the pulverizing party idea, realistically many of the people present will be fueled by petroleum based foods so, as amusing as it may be, it's not really that good an idea.

Roy

On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Greg and April <gregandapril at earthlink.net<mailto:gregandapril at earthlink.net>> wrote:

Why not toss the char in a cement mixer with some rocks?

Greg H.

I have to try as I'm supposed to be an idea type person. Get a good sized piece of the heavy plasic sheeting used to line land fills and such. Decide where to hold a pulverizing party. Lay out the sheeting on the floor and cover it with the lumpy charcoal. Fold the rest of the sheeting on top and clamp the edges, This will have the same sort of attraction as do the plastic bubbles in that wrapping sheeting. Everyone loves to pop them! Everyone one will love to search out and crunch the charcoal lumps. Hold regular charcoal crunching parties or dances. The kids will love it!

Roy

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Michael the Archangel
"Politicians will never solve The Problem;
because they don't realise they are The Problem.".
-Robert ( Bob ) Parsons 1995
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