[Terrapreta] TP theft.

[Kevin Chisholm]

Sean K. Barry wrote:
> Hi Kevin,
>  
> Are there any shards of pottery in the eutrophied lakes in Canada?
Not that I know of. Why do you ask?

Do you feel that pottery shards are essential for TP to function as 
intended? I haven't heard of pottery shards being found in teh Holland 
Marsh, but it seems to work very well.

Best wishes,

Kevin
>  
> SKB
>
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* Kevin Chisholm <mailto:kchisholm at ca.inter.net>
>     *To:* lou gold <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>
>     *Cc:* Sean K. Barry <mailto:sean.barry at juno.com> ; Terrapreta
>     <mailto:Terrapreta at bioenergylists.org>
>     *Sent:* Thursday, November 22, 2007 9:13 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Terrapreta] TP theft.
>
>     Dear Lou
>
>     lou gold wrote:
>     > Hi Sean and All,
>     >
>     > Since Brazil is a poor place, especially in Amazonian rural
>     areas, TP
>     > most likely does get stolen.
>     >
>     > However, I recently saw something about "commercial mining" of
>     it that
>     > sounded very responsible. The guy extracted it but left the bottom
>     > 20cm. It would grow "back to full depth" in 20 years. I'm
>     suspecting
>     > that eventually there will be specialty "nursery" plots growing
>     "seed"
>     > or "starter"  TP  for use in other locations, nearby and far away. .
>     The above comment has enormous potential implications , if it is
>     true.
>     On the one hand,  it may simply be a lie told by a  devious Terra
>     Preta
>     Miner, (TPM)  so that people don't get worked up when he takes their
>     irreplaceable Terra Preta. Given all that has been said on this list
>     about the char requirement for Terra Preta formation, it is likely
>     that
>     the TPM is a blatant liar. :-)
>
>     On the other hand, if the TPM's observation is substantially true and
>     accurate, it completely changes the fundamental formative
>     mechanism for
>     TP. There is a possibility that the TPM is telling the truth, and
>     that
>     Terra Preta can be formed naturally, and charing of biomass by Man
>     was
>     not an essential step in its creation.
>
>     1: There is a pond in front of where I live. In the Summer, pond weed
>     drifts into a cove, and decomposes anaerobically to give a black
>     goop on
>     the bottom When stirred up, the water turns black. The pond weed
>     is not
>     consumed totally by pond life forms, but rather, a black material is
>     left behind. It could be "black carbon."
>
>     2: In Northern Canada, there are millions of hectares of Humified
>     Peat,
>     where  the  the original sedges and mosses  are decomposed to the
>     point
>     that little or none of their original plant structure  remains. What
>     does remain is a "black carbon-like" material.
>
>     3: Many Farmers drain swampy areas, and start a Market Gardening
>     Operation, because  vegetables grow so very well in the "black earth"
>     that they uncover. Do a Google Search on "Terre Noire", "Terre Noire
>     Canada", and "Black Earth". See also
>     > http://www.blackearth.org/History/History.html
>     In speaking to a Member of the Historical Society, the Community of
>     Black Earth seems to be built on a eutrophied lake. However, there
>     was
>     indeed an Indian Community well established there, long before the
>     White
>     Settlers came. The water table is very close to the surface, and
>     buildings of any size require pilings for foundation support.
>
>     There is thus reason to hypothesize that Terra Preta was not man
>     made,
>     but rather, is a natural phenomenon.
>
>     It is interesting to note that on Gerhards site
>     > http://www.gerhardbechtold.com/TP/Belterra2.php?vers=2
>     the Terra Preta locations are generally confined to depressions. It
>     could be that these are sinkholes that were eutrophied. As a
>     depression,
>     they would be a great place for the Natives to dispose of their
>     garbage
>     and broken pottery.
>
>     So, it just might be that the Terra Preta Miner has given a
>     fundamental
>     insight into the formative mechanism for Terra Preta.
>
>     If you are interested in pursuing this further, perhaps you could
>     inquire to determine how many of the Terra Preta Sites in your
>     area are
>     in low lying areas with a high water table.
>
>     I would be very interested in, and appreciative of, any comments or
>     observations you can make.
>
>     Best wishes,
>
>     Kevin
>
>
>     >
>     > I think this is a very attractive story for our messaging --
>     > "sustainable mining" with the TP growing back. It truly is sort of
>     > mind-blowing in terms of standard popular expections about
>     "dirt", and
>     > therefore an attention-getter. And, as TP becomes more known and
>     > valuable, it might be necessary to guard the original Amazonian
>     plots
>     > against theft or irresponsible forms of extraction.
>     >
>     > Happy messaging to all,
>     >
>     > Lou
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > On Nov 21, 2007 10:33 PM, Sean K. Barry <sean.barry at juno.com
>     <mailto:sean.barry at juno.com>
>     > <mailto:sean.barry at juno.com>> wrote:
>     >
>     >     Hi Lou,
>     >     
>     >     I think I saw this way back, middle of 200, on a Cornell
>     website ,
>     >     or EPRIDA, or Christosph Steiner.  I'll see if I can find it.
>     >     They had a picture and described the soil as so valuable that
>     >     thieves come onto TP land and take it away to sell (the illegal
>     >     part is its not their land).  It said also that if some TP
>     soil is
>     >     left on the ground, that it regenerates, but over time.  It
>     is not
>     >     possible, either, to ship TP soil out of Brazil.
>     >     If one sat on 2 meters of the stuff, though, you would think one
>     >     could mine out the bottom meter and a half and sell it, while
>     >     still being able to grow crops.  The world needs a whole lot
>     more
>     >     soil turned into TP soil, though, more than all the TP soil you
>     >     could ever find in the Amazon rain basin.  We are supposed
>     to turn
>     >     France into TP soil many times over!
>     >     
>     >     Regards,
>     >     
>     >     SKB
>     >
>     >         ----- Original Message -----
>     >         *From:* lou gold <mailto:lou.gold at gmail.com>
>     >         *To:* Sean K. Barry <mailto:sean.barry at juno.com>
>     >         *Sent:* Wednesday, November 21, 2007 7:56 AM
>     >         *Subject:* question
>     >
>     >         Hi Sean,
>     >
>     >         Where did you get the idea that lots of terra preta is being
>     >         mined illegally in Brazil?
>     >         I have only seen positive references about how leaving a
>     depth
>     >         of 20cm allows it to
>     >         grow back. Have I missed something?
>     >
>     >         Just asking so that we can all polish our messages.
>     >
>     >         lou
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > --
>     > http://lougold.blogspot.com/
>     > http://www.flickr.com/photos/visionshare/sets/
>     > <http://www.flickr.com/photos/visionshare/sets/>
>     >
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